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William Levesque · Oct 24, 2012

André Azevedo said:
Frinjs was a cheater, simple as that. Senna had strong reasons to do it, not the case with Frinjs.

No, Senna was a complete arse. There is NOT a single good reason to take out a rival to steal a championship, EVER.

Senna, Schumacher and that Frinjs guy, all complete f******.

André Azevedo · Oct 24, 2012

William Levesque said:
No, Senna was a complete arse. There is NOT a single good reason to take out a rival to steal a championship, EVER.

Senna, Schumacher and that Frinjs guy, all complete f******.

Yes, there is. In Senna's case, i think there was.

William Levesque · Oct 24, 2012

André Azevedo said:
Yes, there is. In Senna's case, i think there was.

Well, then please enlighten me.

He basically invented dirty driving, and covered it up in cheeky philophical statements and charity.

Ole Marius Myrvold · Oct 24, 2012

William Levesque said:
Well, then please enlighten me.

He basically invented dirty driving, and covered it up in cheeky philophical statements and charity.

While I do agree. I wonder what I'd done in the same situation. The year before, you get DQ'd in the most strange way ever. Then the pole is on the dirty side, and you get a worse getaway than the guy on the clean side. Which is the same guy that turned into you the season before, and got the title by you being very strangely DQ'd.

I'd probably to a stupid thing, then hand i my own license.

André Azevedo · Oct 25, 2012

That's it. You can find a video of Prost onboard in that race where he obviosly hit Senna intentionally in 89's race, easy to see how different his line was. If Senna's car wasn't there he would entered through the grass BEFORE even hitting the apex... In the end Senna won and Prost ended moaning with Ballestre, who take the title away from Senna in a ridiculously unfair way, saying he shoudln't use the escape zone when it was proved that numerous other cars have done the same before. Next year the same happened when the pole man had the dirty side of the track because of another stupid decision of the big chef. So he simply decided to make justice by his own hands. I understand it, i would do the same. Lose 2 titles in 2 years because someone outside the track decides so it would have been too much.

With Frinjs... There's no reason at all.

André Azevedo · Oct 25, 2012

Do you really think his idea was to do the corner correctly entering the corner like that, 5 meters before the Apex? This guy won the title after this. His intention was to end both races there, that's clear. Senna didn't invent dirty driving, he lost his 2nd tittle because of Prost dirty driving and Ballestre dirty decision. What Senna invented was a way to fly with a car.

Rokas Charlapavicius · Oct 25, 2012

Oops, what have I done...

André Azevedo · Oct 25, 2012

Hehehe

William Levesque · Oct 25, 2012

That's a stupid divebomb.

Ole Marius Myrvold · Oct 26, 2012

William Levesque said:
That's a stupid divebomb.

Could've been if Prost had turned in normally. But now, he's the one that makes the collision happen.

William Levesque · Oct 26, 2012

Ole Marius Myrvold said:
Could've been if Prost had turned in normally. But now, he's the one that makes the collision happen.

I don't disregard the fact that Prost turns in early, I don't like him very much either.... But still, Senna would have found himself to the very far left of the corner exit and put both cars to a near stop the way it was heading, he was over-agressive, as he mostly always was. He thought he could just put his car wherever he wanted and people would bow before him, Prost didn't do that.

I read somewhere that the first time the two met, it was Prost giving Senna a ride from the airport, both got along very nicely and became friends, basically. The event was a Mercedes 190E Spec race for F1 drivers at Nurburgring GP. Prost outqualified Senna which put the latter in complete dementia as he just plain took Prost out at T1 on the first lap, not very nice is it ?

Hampus Andersson · Oct 26, 2012

William Levesque said:
That's a stupid divebomb.

It´s definitely not.

It´s not about how early you brake, it´s about if you can get your car alongside before turn-in.
And despite Prost´s early turn-in, Senna was well deserved of the inside line of that corner.
He had firmly established himself before the corner.

William Levesque · Oct 26, 2012

Hampus Andersson said:
It´s definitely not.

It´s not about how early you brake, it´s about if you can get your car alongside before turn-in.
And despite Prost´s early turn-in, Senna was well deserved of the inside line of that corner.
He had firmly established himself before the corner.

And would have found himself nearly stopped at the exit of the corner on the extreme left, have you seen how quickly he was coming ? Prost would have need to stop on the left at the entry for it to work, reeeeeally ?

Hampus Andersson · Oct 27, 2012

William Levesque said:
And would have found himself nearly stopped at the exit of the corner on the extreme left, have you seen how quickly he was coming ? Prost would have need to stop on the left at the entry for it to work, reeeeeally ?

I think it would have been tight but definitely both could have taken the corner.
Prost could have spent a couple of more meters slowing down rather then taking the corner.
Or in worst case scenario, notice he´s there, undercut him on both corners, get a better exit from the chicane and re-take the spot down to T1.

But really the main thing is he was alongside before turn-in, you can´t deny him the space then.

William Levesque · Oct 27, 2012

Hampus Andersson said:
But really the main thing is he was alongside before turn-in, you can´t deny him the space then.

True, but people see Prost as the ultimate evil in there, all he did was to not bend down like eveyone would do to Senna. I'm not saying it's right, but there you go.

Hampus Andersson · Oct 27, 2012

William Levesque said:
True, but people see Prost as the ultimate evil in there, all he did was to not bend down like eveyone would do to Senna. I'm not saying it's right, but there you go.

They all have their attributes. Prost being fishy with FIA, Senna with his on track antics etc.

André Azevedo · Oct 27, 2012

William Levesque said:
True, but people see Prost as the ultimate evil in there, all he did was to not bend down like eveyone would do to Senna. I'm not saying it's right, but there you go.

He didn't have to bend, he just should have accepted that Senna took the inside and was alongside him... That's racing, take the inside it's racing, probably 60 or 70% of overtakes are like that, what certainly is not racing is to turn in 5 meters before the apex just to hit the car that won position, that's cheating. Prost noticed he lost the position and tried to end both races there, that's pretty obvious. Everybody can see it. If Senna's car wasn't there he would end in the grass...

In this story there was 2 guys cheating, Prost in 89, Senna in 90. The problem is even cheating Prost won the tittle, so If that was the only way to win, Senna learned the lesson and ended both races intentionally too. And he won. The difference between them is that Prost did it first and worse than that ended crying to Ballestre who decided to give him the tittle because Prost's tears were almost drowning everybody around him.

Prost was smashed by Senna in their years, Prost was the man until Senna was in the house. He only won cheating and driving one of the best cars of all time, one of the better Newey's masterpieces. In 88, lost, in 89 Ballester offered him the tille, in 90 lost, in 91 was fired from Ferrari, in 92 was recovering from the hit and in 93 with a space ship lost 4 or 5 races to Senna that had a very inferior car. In 94 just quited because Senna was coming again to be his teammate. He was a traumatized man and he knew he had no talent to match Senna. He was the closest man to beat Fangio until then, but the horror to be smashed again by Senna was too much for him.