Assetto Corsa Payware, Mods Approval discussion

[Shadow Explorer]

I didn't read the entire thread but what I really hope, regarding modded cars.. is that AC will take the time to apply some kind of "censorship" to the mods.. so it will not become just like rFactor with a bunch of crap or unfinished mod..

Mod's can be REALLY good for a simulation but it also kills it on some other aspects..

LOL, thats the most stupid idea I ever encountered...
This will just discourage inexperienced people who want to get into modding
and in the end there will be no new modders...

better help those people if they still exist, to become better so they can produce "better quality" mods...

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Imo everybody should create mods as they deem fit. Its up for the community to decide whether they like it or not and give it a proper rating.

Unfortunately the majority is always right although that may be hard to accept for some.

This is also the exact reason why I dont believe in payware. You can't test a product (mod) up front and most modders haven't got a reputation like a development studio where you know up front what you can expect.

This will result in lots of hype and fanboyism by those that have a financial stake and we have seen that nonsense enough in 2012 already. When you mix "investments", "payments" or whatever you wish to call it with simracing and its community you create a very explosive mixture which results in nasty things.

Are there any software/gaming examples of paid mods that do work flawlessly? Sim Aviation maybe?

 

[2CV SUPER GT]

About legal side, I think the problem is not payware or freeware. The problem I am seeing is to do public release of something that some company bought for using licence as an exclusivity. If EA deal with Porsche for an expensive price wich allow EA to use Porsche licence as they want in total exclusivity, then EA may ask to Porsche : "hey, I lost all my money in game developpement budget in paying your ***ing licence and someone is giving it for free, please protect what you're selling".

About money and modders, the real ask I want to do is "what do you think they deserve in working 3 months at full time (50h/weeks) for one car?"

<if
payware = modder robber
freeware = modder slave?>

If modders could live from modding, were there more much high quality mods?

And for the last, why do we still continue to call it modding when it's just an addon car or addon track, content to download (DLC).

Modding means modification wich is associated in mind for most of people as something to hack the rule of a game. I feel the word "mod" is not really respectfull.


Just some ask and thought for feed the thread

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Its a very interesting subject "modding" but unfortunately nobody with legal knowledge is digging into it to find a final answer.

For me creating scratch build mods is a form of artistic freedom (ripping and converting isn't btw) just like painting.

I can take a brush and paint and sit on the street and paint passing cars and sell those paintings without ever having to worry about a license from a manufacturer. If you apply the same on modding you would think it works the same. You see car, you model it and release/sell it as your own as you are the creator of this art.

Please correct me if I am wrong here, maybe its too simplistic

 

[Dinca Andrei]

Maybe its not that simple since every Studio that release car related games,need license from manufactors before selling the game.I think there are some legal stuf i have no idea what and how but there is something for sure.otherwise Studios like KS should have released the game already,maybe
And you can get more on the painting than you get on a game thats for sure...hehehe

 

[Jari Vinnari]

I believe car manufacturers have full rights for their name but you can "copy" their cars for games as long as its not exact copy of the car.
For example pCars has Asano X4 which in my book is Audi A4 DTM in descise.

 

[Sunil Odedra]

I like the idea, bloody pain in the arse to find a proper mod sometimes when you wander around... Except for the better known one, obviously.

Although the problem with this is, who is respectable enough to judge a mod ? I've tried some mods which were highly regarded, some high rated on rFactorCentral and others (more obscure ones) highly praised on F1-Classic, only to find out they were absolute wank. Good graphics (Mostly) and sounds (More rare), but complete garbage physics. (Ever seen a stock 1999 Civic gripping like a ZR1 Vette ?)

So yeah, we should elect a judging table with people like Niels and Some1

Completely agree with what you guys are saying RE great models and "wank" (lol, not heard that in a while) physics in rfactor mods. I've seen it over and over... However... I think that's a more the fault of the rfactor physics engine and less the modders...

I've read in a interview that the KS boys are just plugging in real world data for weight distribution/suspension, etc. for each of the cars. They've said that if the physics of the car doesn't feel like the real car once they've entered the data then they need to FIX the underlying physics code of the simulation - not the car physics... KS appear to be claiming that the physics of the engine is very very close to reality and so artistic flair when it comes to physics should no longer be required (what the poor sods making mods for rfactor need to do)

So I think it will be relatively easy for someone with data (even approximated as is often all that's available) on a car to plug it in and make a relatively realistic car mod... unless of course it's a 3 wheeled car or something with radically different suspension design, etc

I can dig out the interview if needed. I'll have to have a deep dig, maybe after a wank. er. dunno why i said that

 

[RaceNut]

I believe car manufacturers have full rights for their name but you can "copy" their cars for games as long as its not exact copy of the car.
For example pCars has Asano X4 which in my book is Audi A4 DTM in descise.

The "Not Exact" falls into a gray area that is hard to define and judge. I seem to remember something about LFS using styling's of 2 or 3 different cars to create just one fantasy car.

 

[William Levesque]

I've read in a interview that the KS boys are just plugging in real world data for weight distribution/suspension, etc. for each of the cars. They've said that if the physics of the car doesn't feel like the real car once they've entered the data then they need to FIX the underlying physics code of the simulation - not the car physics... KS appear to be claiming that the physics of the engine is very very close to reality and so artistic flair when it comes to physics should no longer be required (what the poor sods making mods for rfactor need to do)

So I think it will be relatively easy for someone with data (even approximated as is often all that's available) on a car to plug it in and make a relatively realistic car mod... unless of course it's a 3 wheeled car or something with radically different suspension design, etc

That'd be well sweet indeed

 

[Requiem84]

Regarding the quality control of the mod, I would like to see a central website that offers all the mods and provides a user rating system as well. Maybe even a comments section per mod.

 

[Nathan Robinson]

Regarding the quality control of the mod, I would like to see a central website that offers all the mods and provides a user rating system as well. Maybe even a comments section per mod.

That would be great.

 

[William Levesque]

Yeah, rFactorcentral has that. Only issue is that the majority thinks a stock daily driver should handle like a LMP1.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Just let everybody themselves decide what is good or bad, much better system. Nothing so subjective as taste right

Btw: if you are looking for a place to upload stuff fast click the "downloads" tab in the navigation bar and voila

 

[CC]

Regarding the quality control of the mod, I would like to see a central website that offers all the mods and provides a user rating system as well. Maybe even a comments section per mod.

Its called RaceDepartment .

 

[CC]

About legal side, I think the problem is not payware or freeware. The problem I am seeing is to do public release of something that some company bought for using licence as an exclusivity. If EA deal with Porsche for an expensive price wich allow EA to use Porsche licence as they want in total exclusivity, then EA may ask to Porsche : "hey, I lost all my money in game developpement budget in paying your ***ing licence and someone is giving it for free, please protect what you're selling".

About money and modders, the real ask I want to do is "what do you think they deserve in working 3 months at full time (50h/weeks) for one car?"

<if
payware = modder robber
freeware = modder slave?>

If modders could live from modding, were there more much high quality mods?

And for the last, why do we still continue to call it modding when it's just an addon car or addon track, content to download (DLC).

Modding means modification wich is associated in mind for most of people as something to hack the rule of a game. I feel the word "mod" is not really respectfull.


Just some ask and thought for feed the thread

I dont know why they call it modding either ,
To mod , modding something to me ,
means to modify existing content ,

So what happens if you create something from scratch that ?

how is this deemed to be modding ..............

 

[Michael Stead]

Well that'd be close to a record.

 

[Michael Hornbuckle]

I dont know why they call it modding either ,
To mod , modding something to me ,
means to modify existing content ,

So what happens if you create something from scratch that ?

how is this deemed to be modding ..............

Adding to something (such as adding a scratch made car to the roster) is modifying it.

 

[CC]

Adding to something (such as adding a scratch made car to the roster) is modifying it.

I just modified some water too ,
I added coffee powder and 2 sugars

 

[CC]

Adding to something (such as adding a scratch made car to the roster) is modifying it.

Back on topic ,
What do you think about this payware ?

I believe that there is a good market for good strong content ,
I also believe that places like racedepartment would be a good place to add such items as payware ,
But then there is the issues of regulating it ,

Maybe only add payware ,
That was 100% scratch made and proven from the RD threads ect ect ,
But again there is issues of branding and so on ,

Tricky subject

 

[Michael Hornbuckle]

My opinion:
Payware for scratch made mods is fine; payware for rips/unauthorized conversions is not so fine. I don't think RD is an appropriate place to host any of them.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Funny this old thread gets bumped today.

Typed a long reply on my phone but removed it again.

Will post it in a different non ac related discussion thread later.