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A case for R3E as "best racing sim"

Discussion in 'RaceRoom Racing Experience' started by Nick Hill, Jul 30, 2017.

  1. Nick Hill

    Nick Hill
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    I play a lot of different sims and mods from across the sim racing spectrum and there is something about each of them that keeps me coming back for more but, as I ran a really fun offline DTM race this afternoon, I began to think you could certainly make an argument that R3E is the best of them all.

    Hear me out, as a lot of this has to do with what the question "which racing sim is the best?" actually means.

    Is it the sim with the most photo-real graphics? Is it the sim that models the tires down to the molecular level? Is it the sim with the most desirable content? The best sounds? Etc, etc.

    While all of those dimensions mentioned above are certainly important to most sim racers, ultimately isn't the "best racing sim" the one that most faithfully replicates the experience of driving a race car?

    For me, more than any other sim, R3E feels more like "me and the car VS the track and other racers"...whereas many other sims (even ones I am very fond of) feel more like "me VS the car and the track and other racers".

    Full disclosure: like I assume the vast majority of RD posters, I have never driven a real race car, but often ponder if the "me and the car VS the track and other racers" takeaway feeling I consistently get in R3E is the closest thing you can achieve in the comfort of your own basement to the takeaway feeling that a real racing driver does.

    If you want to spin this in a less flattering light, yeah I think you would not be out of line saying I could rephrase what I'm saying as R3E feels "easier" than other sims...I'm challenging the notion that I think many of us sim racers (myself included) fall into thinking there is a strong correlation between difficulty and realism. Lapping (and even more so racing) in R3E makes me strongly question that assumed correlation.

    It may sound crazy, but I sometimes forget that, in real life, a staggering amount of engineering effort has gone into making these cars highly driveable on the ragged edge of performance for lap after lap after lap after lap. No, that doesn't remove driving talent from the occasion, but I can't help but think real world racing drivers feel their relationship with the car to be far more of a partnership than what many/most sims manage to convey.

    One thing I've consistently noticed in R3E that seems to support what I'm saying is that it is very much possible to "overdrive" - you'll still get around the track, but at a diminished pace. Most sims I have played, you can't have much of an expectation to "overdrive" too much/often without wrecking.

    Just food for thought. It's not like I'm planning to exclusively become an R3E racer (I know firsthand there is no way in hell for me to commit to only one sim), but I certainly think it's a sim that I have underestimated from a "simulation value" (sorry, couldn't resist) perspective.
     
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  2. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
    R3E & AMS Club Manager Staff Premium

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    For me, absolutely. That's exactly why R3E is my main racing sim. Sure it currently lacks various features, including some rather important ones like adjustable tyre pressures, and even a proper in-game text chat option. But what it does amazingly well is make me feel like I'm flying around a track in a real racing car.

    Part of that is to do with the physics, which I prefer over many other sims. Like you, I don't sign up to the whole "harder is more realistic" nonsense, and for the same reasons. But it also has to do with a bunch of other things that could be seen as "less important"... the types of car available, the visual style (not necessarily graphical quality), the excellent FFB... and of course, the audio which is nothing short of sublime. Put it all together and you have an excellent package.

    Of course, the final reason R3E is my main sim is the community here, and the fantastic club racing it generates. I don't know why, but driver mentality seems to vary a great deal between different sims. R3E seems to be the preferred choice for gentleman racers.
     
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  3. apex11

    apex11
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    I own currently AC, GSCE, AMS, iRacing, RRE.
    Also on xbox AC ad PCars DiRT rally SLRE.

    For me simply put RRE conveys to me the best feeling from the FFB for the most apart (give or take a few cars but that the same for all sims).
    It's incredible for its recreation of FWD touring cars for one and a a massive fan of touring cars that sways me somewhat.

    But yes i have been addicted to iRacing for the last month because, well because its iRacing its sublime and the whole package is just set up so well and it brings out my psychology and it makes me sweat and panic and get nervous before a 'race'. BUT, swithcing back to RRE for blast around Brands Hatch in group 5 capri, man the feel on RRE it feels to me like its giving serious forces and a serious feel of actually driving the car.
    I have driven racing cars and done track days and at 41 have been ragging cars and motorbikes on and off road for decades.
    I love racing sims and so as you can see i have loads of them, but RRE is so so underrated, just so grateful it exists really.
    I now fully just treat sim racing as a hobby and don't track day or have any dreams now of wasting money paying to go racing, well i still spend money but its a fraction of even what a track day costs, let alone fuel and tyres etc and i can safely say that RRE is my sim of choice to give me the feelings of actually driving a race car on track IMO which is the only opinion to me that really counts.
     
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  4. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
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    Nice to get an opinion from someone that has actually raced some cars. :thumbsup:
     
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  5. apex11

    apex11
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    Well nothing special, but then having said that neither is the skip barber but that is a blast on iRacing!
    For me its that feeling of at the point of being absorbed into the simulated world am i feeling like i'm actually driving a racing car with the feel from the wheel and the feel of being able to lean on the car then its RRE all the way for me.
    I did manage to get PCars working for me and its similar to RRE in many ways (for obvious reason no doubt), but RRE is almost perfect.
    The WTCC cars i can feel when an individual wheel on the front drive train lands after a curb and re gains traction, its utterly mental the feel i get.
    I have all the sims pretty much and play them all and try to divide my time as best i can as each always gives me something i enjoy.
    But RRE recreation of FWD WTCC cars is out of this world.

    I think once you have driven even a track car on a race track you need certain things to happen to the FFB, which may just be canned effects but you need them because you miss that feeling of force you get in real life, RRE seems to convey that very well for me, hard to explain, but i need to feel like i'm leaning on the steering wheel in fast corners as in karting and track work thats what i did...RRE works for me in this respect and that is just with a TX wheel.
    For example some rumble strips shake your teeth out, i need my wheel to shake going over them in game to get the feel i know in real life....a faint noise and tiny vibration doesn't cut it, RRE is brutal over rumble strips so i like that element.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2017
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  6. Karvon26

    Karvon26

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    I have to agree... own RF2, AC (250+ hours played), Dirt rally, Project Cars, automobilista... (basically all of them, including iRacing but with basic content) and the only one where I feel confortable is R3E. The feeling of the car is amazing. Of course as one of you mentioned the are things pending which could be nice to have (tyre pressures, different tyres, multiclass offline, safety car, much more customization for example on the hud, etc) but when i try to go to a different game I always feel things missing and have to come back to R3E. Currently I'm playing an offline championship with a Seat Leon WTCC 2013 and I'm really enjoying it. Recently upgraded from a g27 to a Ts-PC and I'm in love.
     
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  7. J-F Chardon

    J-F Chardon
    SimBin Studios Premium

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    :cry: thanks guys
     
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  8. Andy Jackson

    Andy Jackson
    Veteran member of the PC master race Premium

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    You are welcome. ;)
    For me this sim will be the best when I can play it offline. What are the chances of that one day please? I mean if something was to happen to your company, the servers, our Internet etc etc we wouldn't be able to use the game. It's something I would like to see in the future.
    Appreciate an answer one way or t'other.:):thumbsup:

    Oh and while I'm here I would like to thank you for tightening up the cut track detection. It's really hurting the cheats (they know who they are and they will probably add a smiley or two) who were used to cutting the track wherever they could. It is a joy to behold. Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
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  9. SOLO59

    SOLO59
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    Thats the word... "Comfortable!" Watching real race car drivers absolutely pushing their high powered racing machines around the track with such great control is amazing to watch. So you go and pick your favorite sim and try "pushing the car to its limits" like the pros do. But you end up wrecking, constantly going off track and can't seem to control the car on its limits like the pros. It's ok though, try another sim... Same Damn thing! Lol.... Try another sim and similar results...
    HOWEVER, load up R3E and begin pushing the car to the limit just like the pros. It just feels right. Feels natural. Feels incredible honestly! Because while the cars in R3E can be pushed to their limits with some control, doesn't mean for one second that they are easy to drive. I don't know how they do it, but ever since the Race07 days, the "easy to drive, difficult to master" makes sim racing fun/exciting and equally challenging. I really don't believe there is anything like this on the market.

    With a good pair of headphones/good speakers, trackir/vr, tactile transducers, good wheel and pedals and this sim will bring sim racing to life in your home! I could fall asleep just listening to the various engine sounds of R3E! R3E may not take the checkered flag in every category when comparing to other sims, but at least there's no denying that this sim is a fan favorite most definitely!:)
     
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  10. Christian Moreau

    Christian Moreau
    The real Canadian Prime Minister Premium

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    For me, there's a few key things that it comes down which really set it apart from the other sims that I play. First off, is the feeling right out of the box. I remember installing and starting up the game for the first time and being able to start driving almost right away without having to fool around with too much in the settings. At the time I had a G27, things are even better now with the T300 which I think the devs have done a great job with the default profile. Finding a comfortable FOV and camera settings took me only a few minutes.

    Second, there's something about driving cars in this sim that I can't seem to find anywhere else. It's more than likely just personal taste, but there's something that just feels right about the way I can drive these cars and find their limits. Some may say that the sim is perhaps a little more forgiving than others, and they may be right in some regards, but this is easily the best sim to just jump into a race whenever you want. Very easy to set up a race, choose a track, car class and go.

    The car selection is fantastic and I'm sure it will only get better. I already have my M6 so anything else is just gravy anyway. :D

    The sim has come a long way since I first played it in January of last year. We've had tons of new content added and some requested features implemented as well. I'm sure the platform will continue to grow and become an even better sim for us to play. Time will tell but I think most of us here have confidence! :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2017
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  11. Nick Hill

    Nick Hill
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    A lot of good follow ups in this thread - glad to see I am not the only one with a deep appreciation of the R3E experience! :)

    Not everyone in the community is accepting of this (or willing to admit it), but here is the stark truth: when everything is all said and done, all that really matters in evaluating a sim is "is it fun?" R3E is fun.

    Why are GT Legends and GTR2 still spoken of in hushed tones with such reverence within the community? You hear a lot of reasons given - feature complete, complete car sets, weather (in GTR2, at least), etc, etc. All of that stuff is great and critical parts of the big picture, but let's not forget - those sims are legendary because they are FUN TO DRIVE. The cars are grippy as hell and you feel like you can flog them to within an inch of the limit with confidence.

    In my mind, R3E carries on that tradition. They've found the right balance - the cars are grippy and fun to drive, but not to the point of arcade-style cheese. The end result I think is an *experience* that is much more in line with what a real race driver would recognize than what you get from other ostensibly "more sophisticated" sims.
     
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  12. Christian Moreau

    Christian Moreau
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    This right here. When I play R3E, I am legitimately enjoying myself whether I'm having a good or bad race. And driving around the Nordschleife in this game...:inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove::inlove:
     
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  13. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
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    I just drove R3E in VR for the very first time.

    Holy @#&%!! :confused::confused::confused::confused:

    3.5 hours straight, non-stop. Couldn't get enough of it. R3E with this audio + these physics + this FFB + VR... you're actually in a bloody racing car! Absolutely phenomenal! :thumbsup::cool::inlove:
     
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  14. tlsmikey

    tlsmikey

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    Did you have good visual performance with VR? I really struggled to get acceptable frame rates and visual clarity even with a 1080GTX. I really like this sim, but there are a few things like VR performance that really put me off (especially compared to iRacing and AC). Perhaps the reason i'm so frustrated is that it has so much potential and this game could be epic with a few touches.
     
  15. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
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    My Oculus arrived today, but I missed the graphics card delivery. It means I'm running on my old 750ti, which supposedly doesn't even meet the requirements for VR in general. At Medium graphics R3E is running absolutely fine in VR with 9 opponents, but I have little doubt I could add more if I wanted to without any performance loss. I haven't done anything else special, just set it up as S3 suggest and that was it.
     
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  16. Martin Fiala

    Martin Fiala
    The speed was okay, but the corner was too tight. Premium

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    I'm missing an "envy" reaction. Then again I'm not sure VR would actually work for me.
     
  17. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
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    Why's that Martin?
     
  18. Martin Fiala

    Martin Fiala
    The speed was okay, but the corner was too tight. Premium

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    Well the head tracking part would work, obviously, but I'm not sure about the "being there" part - I only see with one eye, so no 3D for me, ever. Then again maybe 2D would still be enough, given that that's how my world effectively looks like. But the low resolution and screen door effect might ruin it for me in 2D, I fear. Don't know. I'd like to try VR (not only for this reason, obviously), but it's not very likely to happen any time soon.
     
  19. Ross Garland

    Ross Garland
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    That's the big problem with VR... it's a ridiculously high expense if you're not even able to test it first. I'm lucky in that my new housemate has it, so I was able to spend time seeing if it was for me.

    It's probably fair to say that the 3D affect is a big part of the immersion, especially for racing sims. It gives amazing depth perception, allowing for far superior judgement of distances. Of course the ability to look around freely is also amazing, but a similar affect could be achieved much more cheaply with triple monitors or track-ir.

    Oh, and just to tie this post into the thread's subject, R3E in VR is muuuuch more immersive than any other sim I've tried so far.

    One time when I thought about how good R3E feels was a few months back when watching some old DTM footage from the 90's. Those guys absolutely threw those machines around, hitting curbs with wreckless abandon, flying through the air and driving on two wheels, yet the cars looked rock solid and controllable throughout. (For the most part anyway!) In R3E you can do all that and it feels just as you'd think it should from the footage, which is amazing fun. It's not a feeling I've been able to recreate in other sims that feature the cars.
     
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