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5 seconds without vsync

Discussion in 'rFactor 2' started by jimortality, Oct 23, 2015.

  1. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    I was practicing around Spa with the Z4 last night and I'm always one for using vsync on my games. The time I was setting (Slow as per normal) but I tried some different settings and it was maybe down to me getting better but I turned vsync off and was getting 4 to 5 seconds a lap quicker. Surely without vsync can't make that much difference but If it does, how can it be. Cheers
     
  2. Chark

    Chark
    Premium Member

    I personally always run vsync off. As a general rule, that's a way of minimizing input lag. With vsync, everything you see is delayed a bit more, which prevent you from reacting early enough.

    Some people will say they don't notice the lag difference, others will feel the delay immediately. With vsync on, the graphic card waits for your monitor to refresh to send a completely rendered image. Without it, the monitor displays exactly what you card has in its buffer (no matter what, even if one image is half rendered at that time).

    I had found this article a while ago. I know it's in French (I couldn't find an equivalent in Shakespeare's language), but you only need to care about the images. Hope it helps!
     
  3. ouvert

    ouvert
    Premium Member

    last time I had VSync on was in `08 in Max Payne as I overlooked it is on .. never, I`d rather have screentearing (which I don`t get) than VSync on ..
     
  4. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    So you reckon I'm definitely quicker without it? What are your thoughts on adaptive vsync? I know there are other threads about this subject but it's just the fact I was quicker but I don't know whether that's down to me or vsync. My problem has always been trying to get decent graphics hence I use vsync but last night, I capped my frames to 84 and only used the games AA and AF and it was looking sweet.
     
  5. Chark

    Chark
    Premium Member

    For sure vsync is not worth 5 seconds of time on its own. But it's certain that having the least amount of input lag (no vsync) means that you feel and see what you're doing much better, which eventually is making you faster! With vsync I always have that kind of "spongy" feeling, where the car reacts with an unpleasant delay.

    I would not recommend using it. Basically it activates vsync when your card can supply those 60 FPS, and deactivates it if not (so you don't drop straight to 30 FPS).
     
  6. ouvert

    ouvert
    Premium Member

    unless you have screen tearing that prevents you from enjoying the game, just leave it off ...
     
  7. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    Yeah, luckily I don't have any in RF2 but in something like Arma 3 the screen tear is bad. When I can afford a ROJ Gsync I'm going to get one.
     
  8. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    Cheers
     
    • Love Love x 1
  9. kamackeris

    kamackeris
    Premium Member

    I found the game was stuttering with vsync off but runs smooth with vsync on... What settings do you run with, with vsync off to get it running smooth?
     
  10. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    What system do you have?
     
  11. Essentially... Using vsync is acknowledging a problem but using an alternative tool to circumvent rather than alleviate the issue.

    The problems may be stuttering or tearing and vsync will smooth that right out for you. In 'real time' applications though, everything is designed to run through a pipe. Exceed the parameters of the pipe and you get stuttering/slowdowns. When this occurs, vsync will cut the flow but at a cost of latency. When this occurs you see things smoother but feel them delayed which is the exact opposite of what you need to be feeling the car as intended.

    The solutions are simple. Reduce graphic fidelity or features until the problem is no longer apparent. Then decide if you can live with the level of that detail. If not, you have upgrade choices to make.


    Jim, 5 seconds. Mate I can believe that. If you are turning in, in a quarter of a second after you see the image, you'd never hit an apex all lap :D
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  12. William Wester

    William Wester
    Premium Member

    It doesn't necessarily have to do with the ability to render a certain level of graphic fidelity. My CPU may be at 30% max. and GPU pushing out 200 FPS but the monitor cannot process the flow smoothly, unless a technology such as vSync is used to "sync" to the monitor refresh. I could turn down graphics features to bare bones (400 FPS) and still have tearing/stutter. My hardware is more than capable of rendering the graphical elements but the monitor's refresh rate is not in-sync with the pipeline.
    I've timed myself with and without vSync, I'm no faster with or without. I understand some are more sensitive to the effect, it's somewhat like those that must use a lock to horizon feature or they get motion sick.
    Maybe I'm just not fast enough for it to matter :), I usually use vSync as smoothness is more important than the slight delay that may exists, a delay that is VERY hard to notice (to me) and maybe I compensate every so slightly from years of virtual racing. I'm not saying what works for me is what will work for anyone else.
     
  13. kamackeris

    kamackeris
    Premium Member

    I5 6600K gtx 970 and 16gb ram
     
  14. Vsync is not going to cost you anywhere near 5 seconds let a lone a second, because even a slow monitor alone causes similar delay plus the time it takes for your GPU to process frames. For example a 120/144 Hz monitor is not going to improve seconds of laptime, it's just about minimizing all potential lag. Probably it has no practical effect at all unless you are a pro driver and can lap within 0.3 sec each lap.
     
  15. The simplest of tests is to rotate the wheel in the pits and see how much delay is produced the quicker you turn back and forth.

    In decent systems, vsync can have a negligible effect but on systems that are struggling it's quite significant, undrivable for me personally.

    I avoid saying it almost everywhere due to the cost involved but 1440p @144hz is what this game was made for. There is a fluidity and clarity that allows me to remove everything else from my mind and race... race faster and cleaner than ever before.

    So for sure William I agree, look for that monitor upgrade next. John, disagree.
    Only in some circumstances though... a struggling driver in a struggling system could potentially improve that much imo. Lord, I remember the GPL demo, it took me 40 minutes to do a clean lap at the Glen, soon after though with a new system, 3rd in the Aussie championship.

    So much of speed is confidence and if you aren't committed to the turn, you're leaving time there.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. William Wester

    William Wester
    Premium Member

    I'm fine, I wouldn't be able to turn on all the eye candy in most of my sims at the same resolution I'm running now if 144hz refresh - I'm running 34" 3440x1440 (w/GTX980), that's 35% more pixels than a straight 1440p monitor. I'm fine with vSync, I very well aware some others don't like it. UltraWide and smoothness is the price I pay for such a slight delay that I don't notice.
     
  17. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    To be honest Paul, I'm thinking of sticking with Vsync. It just runs a lot smoother with it on and any issues with vsync on I'm sure negates all the micro stuttering and flickering I get with it off. I think the only way to run without is with a decent monitor because I have a 27" K272HL Acer 60hz and I think that has got to be a priority for me to upgrade at some point. I had to turn down shadows, in fact everything and cap the frames at 84 yet it still stutters and looks crap. I'm 10 seconds off the fastest guys at last night race so I don't think the issue with vsync on or off is going to make much difference to me lol
     
  18. kamackeris

    kamackeris
    Premium Member

    yeh...mine is a 24 inch monitor at 60 hz
     
  19. jimortality

    jimortality
    Premium Member

    Do you use in game vsync?
     
  20. kamackeris

    kamackeris
    Premium Member

    Yeh... Runs smooth with and stuttery without