2014 Formula One Belgian Grand Prix

[Decenten]

Its clear in my mind what rosberg`s tactics are to maintain his point lead,
The same tactics happened in monoco and now they happen here.
He was allways going to be in a compromising position on the inside moving into that left turn knowing full well before hand what to expect.
Lewis knows this the team knows this.
These guys are the best in the world and can judge distance very accurately and ive no doubt in my mind it was on purpose.
These guys can thread a needle @ 200 mph,
Judging the time it takes to walk through a closing door without being hit we all can do.
If you think for one second this was a accident you must have real bad coordination and spatial awareness.
Any of us sitting here now could of avoided this from happening....

Dirty and dangerous....
But as far as taking a driver out with perfect timing to make just the correct amount of contact this was flawless and perfectly done...well done nico great sportsmanship and great timing, Your a deserving world champion when you can pull off such a perfectly timed assault on his rear tire.

In case youtube delete my vid..
http://www.freeleacher.webspace.virginmedia.com/yeah-right.mp4

In my opinion Nico was entitled to stay down the inside as Hamilton needed to give room. If there was no overlap then Hamilton would have been able to stay on the racing line but there was overlap as shown by Hamilton and Nico colliding. Alonso and Button ran side by side through there and Button was in the same position as Nico and ended up in front of Alonso

 

[kelaroost]

nico had no intention of overtaking he was setting up to end the race of his team mate.
Not once did he get his car in a position to threaten to overtake he was way back and no where close to lewis peripheral vision.

Pls look at the vid I posted on page before this.
Watch the horizon how sudden he turns into his team mate.
He new exactly what was going to happen he planned it knowing full well of the consequences.
The more I watch that vid the more I am convinced it was deliberate and it frankly makes my blood boil.


http://www.freeleacher.webspace.virginmedia.com/yeah-right.mp4

That vid above will make anyone change there mind and if it don't I ask you to ask yourself this question.
If he cant avoid such a collision what`s he doing in a f1 car ???
Fact is it was on perpose because no f1 driver is that bad.
He punched that wheel with malice cant you see that ?

 

[Nelson Ullinskey]

In my honest opinion, this was just a freak racing accident. No one is too blame, sure they could have given a bit more room, but nonetheless it was an accident. However, if this occurs in Monza, well then I think Nico is out to get Lewis.

Again, this is my opinion, I am not saying that I am right or anyone else is wrong.

 

[Emerson Meyer]

Very nice race!
Magnussen 5 x 0 Alonso

 

[Decenten]

I watched the video and Nico had a bit of understeer followed by oversteer into the corner and he needed to have a second go into the corner. He wasnt trying to take him out if he continued on without that second go at the steering wheel he would have ran wide over the ripple strip which would have cost him time and possibly spun the car. I still think Hamilton needs to learn to give room. He seems to think that he has the right to cut Nico off and his attitude after the incident was terrible.
In school we are taught to be persistent and never give up but Hamilton was whining on the radio. This incident could have been avoided by both Hamilton and Rosberg but it was still a racing incident and Hamilton needs to get over it and continue on with his race. Look at Webber last year in the German GP. His team made a mistake causing the wheel to fall off and a pitlane penalty plus extra time for his team to push him back to the garage to replace the missing tyre, and he still finished inside the top ten even though he was a lap down and almost certain of not making a point.

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

F1 2014 Belgian GP - Rosberg & Hamilton Overtake …:

To me that sums it up, Rosberg was never far enough up in his attempt to where Hamilton should give him more room than did. He had the right to the racing line and Rosberg failed to back out of his failed attempt on a pass.
Personally I don't think the onboard proves it was deliberate, I see him correcting an oversteer as much as anything else, but what was said after the race makes me wonder.
Will be a exciting end of this season I'm sure, gloves are bound to be off now.

 

[theravenousbeast]

Correcting oversteer? Yeah right. I bet you if Lewis gets even a slight chance at Monza he'll send Nico off into a gravel trap rallycross style and the stewards won't do anything about it.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Basic opposite lock and not a case of turning you wheel to gather a momentum to turn, that would be stupid. But he didn't slow down enough that's why the contact happened, that is the point he was making, i will not back down even if it means both of us crash. I said it already, Senna-defense with slight twist "if there's a gap i'll take it, if there isn't a gap i'll make it" latter part of course meaning what ever it takes, you are not going to drive to the finishline before me. Later that would've bee harder, Lewis then could've had a chance of outdriving him.. That is not fair but it is a powerful message, honeymoon is over, gloves are off. Nico of course is now under watchful eyes, both from FIA and from Mercedes. If he does it again, i'm pretty sure they will suspend him and get a different driver for the rest of the season. Lauda and Wolf were pretty determined to let this never happen again, they still got both championships so it's not like Nico is totally indispensable.. There are lots of drivers that can take that car to points, each race.. So he really went to the knifes edge.

Advantage: Lewis. He has pretty much free pass on any incident they might have and has proven a point too but earlier in the season: he can outdrive Rosberg. Nicos dad is pretty ruthless too, think Nelson Piquet or Emerson Fittipaldi, definitely now the villain of the story Anything for the win.. But protagonists don't always win. Part I of the trilogy, the Evil Empire rises and our heroes are in trouble (dramatic enough?)

I would like to see that the points he got from Spa are lost stripped and maximum one race ban and additional grid penalty so he scores points in the second race but won't extend the lead in the next two races.. Adds more drama, this could be a start of legendary rivalry that goes on and on... Rush 2?

 

[Decenten]

Hamilton could still have given room to Rosberg. Hamilton put his rear tyre on the line by not giving the room. Obviously he couldn't cut back onto the racing line as Rosberg did have an overlap which was why Hamilton got a puncture. Hamilton was so caught up in staying ahead even though Rosberg was faster that he didnt leave room. Alonso and Button went side by side there without hitting each other why cant the top 2 drivers in the championship do the same thing?

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

If you wanted to make a point (i will not yeild even if it causes accidents) what would you do, make wild turns on the wheel with a car that has right proportion of the car already loading the right corners, balanced to turn with the corner or would you instead just not back down? The flick is opposite lock, automatic reflex, has nothing do with the intention of not slowing down: he came to the corner like Lewis wasn't even there. Was expecting everything from total mayhem to slight brush. With modern cars, that is a risk you can take.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

At that place in turn, you can not use mirrors, you need to either see no one in the side peripheral vision (or slightly even turning your helmet) or front tire. That in practice means Nicos right side tire would have to be inline with your sidepod/cooling entry. Rolling hoop aligned with front wing is another good measure point for other "detection zone". Nico never went further than either of them and in fact losing the corner. That is where trust and respect comes in, you have trust that other party respects you and racing as a sport to keep it safe and contact free.

 

[Decenten]

Hamilton wasnt backing down either as he could have easily left room for them to run side by side. Unfortunately they both made the wrong choices. Hamilton not leaving room for Rosberg and Rosberg expecting Hamilton to leave room. All in all Rosberg deserved more room and this shows how much respect Hamilton had for Rosberg both for this conflict.

 

[Decenten]

Rosberg was alongside Hamilton down the straight. Hamilton knew he was there and knew that Rosberg had more pace. Of course Rosberg wasnt going to back down. Hamilton has never backed down this season for Rosberg. Look at Bahrain where Hamilton used a fuel setting that he wasnt supposed to to win the race. Then in Hungary he didnt let Rosberg past even though they were on different strategies and Hamilton was slowing him down. Hamilton hasn't backed down once during this season for Rosberg and if he wanted to finish well in that race racing room and respect is needed and both drivers lacked that in this incident.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

One can also think of it as weight transfer. Does opposite lock type quick flick have time to transfer enough weight so the car can do sort of scandinavian flick unbalancing action? Or does it have enough weight transfer to balance the load on rear tires while decreasing steering angle at the same time and rotating briefly over neutral, forward trajectory, stopping the oversteer? That movement also causes forces on steering column to lighten as both front tires are now starting to balance the load between them. Lets say that you are using force to correct your correction, return to neutral state before that sequence of events started, you are going to off shoot your mark and turn just a bit too much. Also you have to compensate for that slight time you were not turning enough but actually rotating in reverse direction (that piece of graph could be averaged as a straight line between the two points, start and end since we are doing this in reference to time)

Classic snap oversteer caused by too much entry speed and how you correct it without making drastic changes to optimal racing line. You would not unload your left front tire if you want to turn more to the right.

 

[Chris]

Rosberg was alongside Hamilton down the straight. Hamilton knew he was there and knew that Rosberg had more pace. Of course Rosberg wasnt going to back down. Hamilton has never backed down this season for Rosberg. Look at Bahrain where Hamilton used a fuel setting that he wasnt supposed to to win the race. Then in Hungary he didnt let Rosberg past even though they were on different strategies and Hamilton was slowing him down. Hamilton hasn't backed down once during this season for Rosberg and if he wanted to finish well in that race racing room and respect is needed and both drivers lacked that in this incident.

I completely disagree.

Firstly, Lewis apologized to Nico in Spain after he used a higher engine setting without authorization from the team. That wasn't Bahrain. In Bahrain, Lewis beat Nico fair and square.

Secondly, in Hungary, Nico was faster than Hamilton in his second stint because he was on relatively new soft tyres. However, he caught up to Hamilton just as his soft tyres were starting to go off, so he couldn't get close enough to overtake. Hamilton even said, "if Nico can get close enough, he's free to overtake, but I'm not slowing down for him."
If Hamilton conceded that place, he'd have lost too much time and Nico would have passed him at the end of the race.

The team then confirmed that Lewis was correct in not slowing down for Nico.
Lewis is already on the back foot thanks to reliability. So conceding to his team mate is the last thing he wants to do in such a close title fight. Mercedes are going to win the constructors, so the WDC is all that the drivers are focussing on.

Finally, on to Spa.
Lap 2:

• Lewis was ahead of Nico on the Kemmel Straight.
• Nico had the slipstream, and pulled along side lewis before the braking zone at Le Combes. Nico was never ahead of Lewis.
• Lewis then out-braked Nico and had the racing line through Le Combes.
• Nico didn't concede the position entirely, trying overtake around the outside (Nuts!).
• Nico lost ground because he wasn't on the racing line. Lewis was.
• Nico did not comply with the regulations that state that you must have a significant portion of your car alongside the other for you to be given space for a corner.
• Nico's front wing was only just alongside Lewis's left rear tyre. This does not constitute a "significant portion" being along side.
• This was Lewis's corner, and Nico should have backed out.

I don't think it was malicious (contrary to some media reports) but it was 100% Nico's fault, and if you think otherwise, you're blind.

Edit:
However, reports from Mercedes post race debrief have revealed that Nico did not concede the position early enough because he wanted to "prove a point" to Lewis. This means, that he wasn't necessarily trying to hit Lewis, however he was actively putting himself and his teammate in an unnecessarily risky situation. Which by extension, essentially means he did it on purpose, and any incident after that was due to this.

Any shred of respect I once had for Nico after the incident is now gone. The guy is totally classless, and does not deserve to win this years championship.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

^That. Look at YAW, not steering angle. Car does not care where the tires point, it cares about movement around three acis, this time our concnetration is on YAW, is the car turning more or less compared to the optimal trajectory that will take the object around and arc or curve, ie how soon can he return to optimal path with least amount of time: By driving like Lewis is not there anymore, placing his car on to the same space/time in the near predictable future (few tenths in time, distance to the apex), one of those have to yeild as two objects can not occupy same space at the same time..

 

[kelaroost]

Amazes me how sneaky nico is,
His done this a few times this year,
close enough to make it look like it could of been a accident but effective enough to give what he wants.
His a very dirty racer and when he cant win clean he has to play dirty but try and make it look like his not.
Disgrace he deserves a 2 race ban.
He put a lot of malice into that sharp cut in knowing full well of the outcome.
If I was driving and wanted to take another racer out I would of done it the exact same way.
You can see the malice and I bet he was crinching his nose when he made contact.

Take that lewis...and nico laughs to himself when making the contact...
Disagree all you want but it don't change the fact that's its all true.
Its all caught on camera.....
Best drivers in the world that have driven 100000s of miles on all types of machines and tracks and you think it was a accident.
Dam even on go carts this would be seen as a malicious move.

Nico is very malicious and that has surprised me a lot.

 

[Decenten]

I completely disagree.

Firstly, Lewis apologized to Nico in Spain after he used a higher engine setting without authorization from the team. That wasn't Bahrain. In Bahrain, Lewis beat Nico fair and square.

Secondly, in Hungary, Nico was faster than Hamilton in his second stint because he was on relatively new soft tyres. However, he caught up to Hamilton just as his soft tyres were starting to go off, so he couldn't get close enough to overtake. Hamilton even said, "if Nico can get close enough, he's free to overtake, but I'm not slowing down for him."
If Hamilton conceded that place, he'd have lost too much time and Nico would have passed him at the end of the race.

The team then confirmed that Lewis was correct in not slowing down for Nico.
Lewis is already on the back foot thanks to reliability. So conceding to his team mate is the last thing he wants to do in such a close title fight. Mercedes are going to win the constructors, so the WDC is all that the drivers are focussing on.

Finally, on to Spa.
Lap 2:

• Lewis was ahead of Nico on the Kemmel Straight.
• Nico had the slipstream, and pulled along side lewis before the braking zone at Le Combes. Nico was never ahead of Lewis.
• Lewis then out-braked Nico and had the racing line through Le Combes.
• Nico didn't concede the position entirely, trying overtake around the outside (Nuts!).
• Nico lost ground because he wasn't on the racing line. Lewis was.
• Nico did not comply with the regulations that state that you must have a significant portion of your car alongside the other for you to be given space for a corner.
• Nico's front wing was only just alongside Lewis's left rear tyre. This does not constitute a "significant portion" being along side.
• This was Lewis's corner, and Nico should have backed out.

I don't think it was malicious (contrary to some media reports) but it was 100% Nico's fault, and if you think otherwise, you're blind.

Edit:
However, reports from Mercedes post race debrief have revealed that Nico did not concede the position early enough because he wanted to "prove a point" to Lewis. This means, that he wasn't necessarily trying to hit Lewis, however he was actively putting himself and his teammate in an unnecessarily risky situation. Which by extension, essentially means he did it on purpose, and any incident after that was due to this.

Any shred of respect I once had for Nico after the incident is now gone. The guy is totally classless, and does not deserve to win this years championship.

About that chris, I agree with you about the Spain race I thought it was in Bahrain but wrong but even though Lewis apologised he still did it knowing that he wasn't meant to. If nico apologised for that crash would it be okay. In a race if you were lewis would you give room to the other driver? Or if you were nico would you carry your momentum through the corner. If Lewis gave room, nico would have gotten through due to having more speed then Lewis.
I agree that if nico makes a move like that again then he is undeserving of the world championship but the attitude Lewis should after this crash is disgraceful. He should have a better reaction to the crash. Yes he was at the back of the pack and had quite a lot to catch up but saying that they should retire is stupid. You never see caterham or marussia retire just because they have fallen behind. Is what the younger generation should be shown. Yes that move nico made has two sides to it and many of us disagree with the other over it but Lewis should show better attitude and be more persistent about it. That was the first time I have witnessed some one retire due to having a "mood". Come on he is a F1 driver and is in the fastest car. Anything could have happened.

 

[Chris]

About that chris, I agree with you about the Spain race I thought it was in Bahrain but wrong but even though Lewis apologised he still did it knowing that he wasn't meant to. If nico apologised for that crash would it be okay. In a race if you were lewis would you give room to the other driver? Or if you were nico would you carry your momentum through the corner. If Lewis gave room, nico would have gotten through due to having more speed then Lewis.
I agree that if nico makes a move like that again then he is undeserving of the world championship but the attitude Lewis should after this crash is disgraceful. He should have a better reaction to the crash. Yes he was at the back of the pack and had quite a lot to catch up but saying that they should retire is stupid. You never see caterham or marussia retire just because they have fallen behind. Is what the younger generation should be shown. Yes that move nico made has two sides to it and many of us disagree with the other over it but Lewis should show better attitude and be more persistent about it. That was the first time I have witnessed some one retire due to having a "mood". Come on he is a F1 driver and is in the fastest car. Anything could have happened.

Lewis didn't give up.
He couldn't physically drive any faster. His floor was completely destroyed and it would have been smarter to retire the car, save the engine mileage (which is even more important after he lost an engine in Hungary qualifying), for the rest of the season.
And then critics try to turn this around on him as if he gave up and threw his toys out of the pram.
It's complete rubbish, and not at all a fair accusation.
Retiring earlier would've been the smartest thing to do!

Also, to say he should've had better reaction to the crash is also wrong! It wasn't his fault, of course he has every right to be pissed off with Nico. It was 100% Nico's fault!

Also, I'd like to add that just 1 lap prior to the incident, Vettel tried the exact same move on Lewis at the same place, and was even further ahead than Nico was, and he had the presence of mind to back out of it.

I'm not even going to comment on this anymore. I'm so angry about what has happened, and then people have the audacity to lay blame at Lewis. It's utterly ridiculous!

 

[Victor Ivanov]

The problem is that everybody hate Hamilton and everything he does is wrong. He would have been wrong if they didn't make the contact cause he's soft. Then the contact happened and he's the one to blame again. Then the car is broken and he's a cry baby. He didn't let Nico in Hungary he's no team player, he got his Q lap in Monaco destroyed - yet again his fault. Basically whatever Hamilton does or not he's the one to be guilty for it.
"Nico was faster" - how the hell people realized that after 1 lap? Hamilton took the lead while Nico was sleeping at the start. Would you say that Vettel was faster too cause he had an attempt in lap 1 and he also overtook Nico at T1? No. Then how was Nico faster at any point? He just had slipstream at the straight and made late dive on the outside. This would never work even on rookie driver.

In the end - it doesn't really matter who hit who. The only thing that matters is that was an avoidable accident and it broke the rule number one in motorsport - YOU SHOULD NEVER EVER CRASH INTO YOUR TEAMMATE.